Project IDEAL (projectideal.org)is a consortium of states interested in
using distance learning to reach adult learners.  We support states in
providing professional development, developing distance learning plans and
implementing and supporting DL efforts.  We also play an active role in
discussions about DL at the national level.

Leslie Petty

On Tue, Oct 13, 2009 at 9:49 AM, <jenifer.vanek at spps.org> wrote:


>

> Promoting DL is a huge focus of our state's ABE department.  We are working

> on it in St. Paul.  Our first lesson learned doing outreach was that our ABE

> sites needed to have some idea of how to set up and administrate DL

> programming before they could integrate new technology.   Jumping right into

> online learning was not terribly efficient.

>

> Jen Vanek

> St. Paul Public Schools ABE

> jenifer.vanek at spps.org

>

>

>

>

>   *Paul Rogers <pumarosa21 at yahoo.com>*

> Sent by: technology-bounces at nifl.gov

>

> 10/12/09 09:28 AM

> Please respond to The Technology and Distance Learning Discussion List

>

>

>         To:        The Technology and Distance Learning Discussion List <

> technology at nifl.gov>

>         cc:

>         Subject:        [Technology 2377]  promoting distance learning

>

>

>

>  Does this list or does anyone on this list work on promoting technology

> and particularly distance learning?

> I attended a CATESOL conference over the weekend and I could see that there

> is a real need for lots of education and "outreach" to bring the benefits of

> technology to ESL practioners.

>

> Paul Rogers

> 805-258-3310

> pumarosa21 at yahoo.com

> PUMAROSA.COM

>

> --- On *Thu, 10/1/09, jenifer.vanek at spps.org <jenifer.vanek at spps.org>*wrote:

>

> From: jenifer.vanek at spps.org <jenifer.vanek at spps.org>

> Subject: [Technology 2373] Re: Technological Literacy Framework -proxy

> hours/media rich on-line learning

> To: "The Technology and Distance Learning Discussion List" <

> technology at nifl.gov>

> Cc: JUDY.MORTRUDE at spps.org, "Tom Cytron-Hysom" <thysom at real-time.com>,

> reders at pdx.edu

> Date: Thursday, October 1, 2009, 3:32 PM

>

>

> Cathy,

> We're piloting a new software called Learner Web.  Basically, it has the

> potential to solve the last problem you mentioned regarding our inability to

> get credit or seat time for the wonderful media rich websites that are out

> there.   Learner Web is basically framework structured by goals.  Each goal

> has steps and within each step there are resources that a learner accesses

> to help them accomplish the step & work toward the goal.    These resources

> can be the cool stuff you see online but know you cant collect proxy hours

> for.   There is also a workspace associated with each step in Learner Web.

>  What we do with the Workspace is present a quiz or some other assessment

> measures the learner's comprehension of what they saw in the resources

> (those cool external to Learner Web websites).    We've been encouraged by

> our state department of education to figure out proxy hour awards for the

> content we are building into & linking to in Learner Web. We are doing this

> because we need to find a way to get our ABE learners using the internet AND

> because we eventually want to use distance learning as a way to reach a new

> audience - those who never come to us in the first place.   The project is

> still a pilot (actually "national demonstration project").  You can check it

> out by going to www.learnerweb.org.

>

> Jen Vanek

> St. Paul Adult Learning/St. Paul Community LIteracy Consortium

>

>

>

>

>   *"Cathy Coleman" <cathyc at qcc.mass.edu>*

> Sent by: technology-bounces at nifl.gov

> 10/01/09 01:26 PM

> Please respond to The Technology and Distance Learning Discussion List

>

>         To:        "The Technology and Distance Learning Discussion List" <

> technology at nifl.gov>

>         cc:

>         Subject:        [Technology 2373] Re: Technological Literacy

> Framework        -proxy        hours/media rich on-line learning

>

>

> You are so right. Knowing the amount of effort being made on a lesson

> is important.  I've had some students buzz through a lesson of say 18 or

> 19 screens in under 5 minutes or have a pattern of highly interrupted

> study time.. 2 mins on lesson 3, followed by 3.5 mins on lesson 3 etc.

> It's interesting, and I'm not sure if it has to do with the way the

> system measures time. It could be that if a student doesn't move the

> mouse for a time, they get timed out and that's why that pattern is

> seen. In terms of the time they spend on a lesson in the software, if

> they can actually get it, I'm fine w/ their doing it in 5 minutes, but

> that is almost never the case.

>

> Some of the information you can get in a software program like MHC is

> helpful for sure. An interesting and disheartening trend I have found

> through looking at the reports is that a number of students seem to

> believe that by simply doing the quizzes and tests in the software over

> and over again, they will learn the content. They call me and are

> frustrated that they can't get past a certain point in the program. It

> keeps saying they need to do it again. I ask how the lesson went that

> preceded the quiz, and they confess they didn't do the lesson. *sigh*

>

> Another concern I have with the kind of drill and kill software

> that seems to abound in GED is that the feedback given to students

> regarding wrong answers is often pretty lame -- something to the effect

> of "Sorry. That is not correct" It amounts to "The answer is d because

> it is not a, b, c, or e." -- not very useful in terms of learning, and

> students who get stuck unfortunately don't always have the study

> skills/metacognitive skills to know that this is a time to get some help

> from the teacher. They just keep guessing until they get it right which

> is somewhat encouraged by the fact that the software has it set up to do

> the same quiz until they pass it.

>

> I should clarify maybe though regarding measuring time. I agree that

> knowing the time someone spends doing their GED work is useful to a

> degree, but I guess that basically I agree with what Michael said. I'd

> like to know if students are cognitively engaged which, unfortunately,

> is a lot harder to measure. I'd also like to take advantage of the rich

> resources available on the internet and encourage  students to more

> actively engage with ideas and technology they encounter, but... What's

> that old saying? What counts is what's counted. It's harder to measure

> proxy hours when you send a student to a great interactive web site, and

> unfortunately there is a disincentive built in for sending students

> there if we have such a focus on seat time.  For example, I send

> students to a great website that has a flash version of base ten cubes,

> which, when used with some well thought out questions from teachers, is

> nearly always more valuable than the minutes measured spent in

> frustration on the decimal lesson in the software.

>

>

> Cathy

>

> QCC GED Online:"Where giving up is not an option"

> Cathy Coleman

> GED Online Coordinator/Instructor

> Quinsigamond Community College

> 508-854-2725

> CathyC at qcc.mass.edu

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: technology-bounces at nifl.gov [mailto:technology-bounces at nifl.gov]

> On Behalf Of Susan Jones

> Sent: Wednesday, September 30, 2009 6:04 PM

> To: technology at nifl.gov

> Subject: [Technology 2371] Re: Technological Literacy Framework -proxy

> hours/media rich on-line learning

>

> Very good points.

>

> I can tell you that it's very important, when people come back to us and

> say "why did this work?" or "why didn't this work?"  to be able to

> discern how much time a student spent doing "this."

>

>

>

> Susan Jones

> Academic Development Specialist

> Center for Academic Success

> Parkland College

> Champaign, IL  61821

> 217-353-2056

> sujones at parkland.edu

> Webmastress,

> *http://www.resourceroom.net* <http://www.resourceroom.net/>

> *http://bicyclecu.blogspot.com* <http://bicyclecu.blogspot.com/>

>

>

> >>> jenifer.vanek at spps.org 9/29/2009 1:28 PM >>>

> Michael & everyone,

> I think there are two separate issues here:

> 1-Computer based or on-line learning tools that have rich media options.

> 2-Need to track seat time (proxy hours) for time spent using these

> tools.

>

> We want our learners to have an opportunity to use on-line learning.

> Many

> move on to post-sec education where they must take on-line classes.

> Having

> the rich media options builds interest and makes it easier for them to

>

> learn to be on-line learners.   Also important is to give the learners

> a

> chance to be engaged in distance learning, since this is a vital part of

>

> on-line learning in post-secondary institutions.   In our program we

> cannot ignore the question of seat time or proxy hours.  For our

> distance learning programming to be financially sustainable, we need to

> report these hours to the state.

>

> I think we can have learner centered, media rich programming in our

> on-line/distance learning classes.   In fact, we must figure out a way

> to

> do this well to be relevant!

>

> Jen Vanek

> ABE Instructor/Learner Web Regional Admin for St. Paul

>

> www.learnerweb.org

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Michael Ormsby <michaelormsby at mac.com>

> Sent by: technology-bounces at nifl.gov

> 09/29/09 10:58 AM

> Please respond to The Technology and Literacy Discussion List

>

> To:     The Technology and Literacy Discussion List

> <technology at nifl.gov>

> cc:

> Subject:        [Technology 2365] Re: Technological Literacy

> Framework

>

>

> Hello Cathy,

> I'm familiar with the MHC programs, as well as Steck-Vaughn, Plato,

> Aztec, and a few others.  The essential problem with this type of

> computer directed learning is that it's text-based.  It assumes that

> learners can learn effectively by reading text on a computer monitor.

> Yes, some of the programs include a voice over for the text, but that

> doesn't overcome the basic flaw.  I keep asking myself, why would anyone

> think that adult learners who did not complete high school or in some

> cases middle school can learn effectively from reading text on a

> computer or in a book?

>

> I too wonder about all the emphasis in measuring 'seat time'?  As an

> educator I'm much more interested in trying to figure out if my students

> are really learning anything and are being engaged cognitively.  What's

> the point of producing all sorts of reports about how the students do on

> quizzes if the quizzes are really measuring anything important.

>

> I'm a strong advocate of computer direct learning, but the way it's

> being used is not doing much more than offering an alternative to

> worksheets and drill and practice.  I see the real power of CDL as

> producing a truly individualized learning experience for the learner,

> one that adapts to exactly what they need to be successful.  I look at

> it as a way to go back to one-on-one learning, much like the

> apprenticeship.

>

>

> Michael Ormsby

> CEO, Essential Education Corporation

> *http://www.essentialed.org/* <http://www.essentialed.org/>

> *541-740-4717*

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

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-- 
Leslie Petty, Ed.D.
Associate Director
Project IDEAL Support Center
University of Michigan
734-425-0748
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